J1939 turn signals

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J1939 turn signals

John Dammeyer

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. 1 250 544 4950

 

 

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Re: J1939 turn signals

Dr K H Tang
Hello John, you may refer to PGN 65089.

On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 7:44 AM, John Dammeyer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. <a href="tel:1%20250%20544%204950" value="+12505444950" target="_blank">1 250 544 4950

 

 




--
Dr K H Tang
Controller Area Network Solutions (M) Sdn Bhd
30, Jalan Puteri 5/12, Bandar Puteri, 47100 Puchong, Selangor, Malaysia.
http://www.cans.com.my
Mobile: +60 (0)12-306 2054
Tel: +60 (0)3-8061 6678 / 9678     Fax: +60 (0)3-8061 3789
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Re: J1939 turn signals

Simon Byholm
Hello John

Here's from the standard for the PGN 65089

"Flashing is accomplished by sending the lighting message with the state alternately ON or OFF"

Simon

Simon Byholm - Software Manager / Quality Manager

Phone: +358 6 357 6306
Fax: +358 6 357 6320
email: [hidden email]
web: www.tke.fi

TK Engineering solves your CAN, CANopen, J1939 and NMEA2000 problems by providing the hardware, software and know-how you need to design, manufacture and troubleshoot your industrial and heavy machine CAN networks. Call +358 6 357 6300 or email [hidden email] to learn how we can help you solve your CAN related problems.
On 22.3.2016 5:32, Dr KH Tang wrote:
Hello John, you may refer to PGN 65089.

On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 7:44 AM, John Dammeyer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:1%20250%20544%204950" value="+12505444950" target="_blank">1 250 544 4950

 

 




--
Dr K H Tang
Controller Area Network Solutions (M) Sdn Bhd
30, Jalan Puteri 5/12, Bandar Puteri, 47100 Puchong, Selangor, Malaysia.
http://www.cans.com.my
Mobile: +60 (0)12-306 2054
Tel: +60 (0)3-8061 6678 / 9678     Fax: +60 (0)3-8061 3789

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RE: J1939 turn signals

John Dammeyer
In reply to this post by John Dammeyer

Thank you.  The client uses that PGN  but not to the specification as listed in this file.

http://211.167.243.154:1012/file/gwbz/ISO%2011783-7-2002.PDF

 

But then this document is 2002 and for trailers so it may have been superseded and may not be relevant to the actual vehicle.  In either case that specification lists no less than 1 per second and no more than 10x per second which implies the master is responsible for the flashing.  Not the lamp. 

 

The lamp only turns on or off based on messages.

 

Of course this client also wanted all 4 lamps to report status information with the same ID.  Can you spell CAN message collision???

 

Sigh….  With the CAN bus in use now for more than 25 years one would think this wouldn’t happen anymore.

 

J1939 is such a mess…

 

John

 

 

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dr KH Tang
Sent: March-21-16 8:33 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [CANLIST] J1939 turn signals

 

Hello John, you may refer to PGN 65089.

 

On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 7:44 AM, John Dammeyer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. <a href="tel:1%20250%20544%204950" target="_blank">1 250 544 4950

 

 



 

--

Dr K H Tang
Controller Area Network Solutions (M) Sdn Bhd
30, Jalan Puteri 5/12, Bandar Puteri, 47100 Puchong, Selangor, Malaysia.
http://www.cans.com.my
Mobile: +60 (0)12-306 2054
Tel: +60 (0)3-8061 6678 / 9678     Fax: +60 (0)3-8061 3789

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Re: J1939 turn signals

Simon Byholm
Seems like PGN 65088 Lighting Data is used to report status, but
it's use is not entirely clear from the standard.

To have the message turn on/off the lights directly helps keep the
lights in sync, otherwise the controllers would need separate sync
mechanism so have all the lights on the tractor and trailer blink at the
same time.

Would look weird to have different frequencies and start times, don't
you think :)

Simon
Simon Byholm - Software Manager / Quality Manager

Phone: +358 6 357 6306
Fax: +358 6 357 6320
email: [hidden email]
web: www.tke.fi

TK Engineering solves your CAN, CANopen, J1939 and NMEA2000 problems by providing the hardware, software and know-how you need to design, manufacture and troubleshoot your industrial and heavy machine CAN networks. Call +358 6 357 6300 or email [hidden email] to learn how we can help you solve your CAN related problems.
On 22.3.2016 8:51, John Dammeyer wrote:

Thank you.  The client uses that PGN  but not to the specification as listed in this file.

http://211.167.243.154:1012/file/gwbz/ISO%2011783-7-2002.PDF

 

But then this document is 2002 and for trailers so it may have been superseded and may not be relevant to the actual vehicle.  In either case that specification lists no less than 1 per second and no more than 10x per second which implies the master is responsible for the flashing.  Not the lamp. 

 

The lamp only turns on or off based on messages.

 

Of course this client also wanted all 4 lamps to report status information with the same ID.  Can you spell CAN message collision???

 

Sigh….  With the CAN bus in use now for more than 25 years one would think this wouldn’t happen anymore.

 

J1939 is such a mess…

 

John

 

 

 

From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dr KH Tang
Sent: March-21-16 8:33 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [CANLIST] J1939 turn signals

 

Hello John, you may refer to PGN 65089.

 

On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 7:44 AM, John Dammeyer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:1%20250%20544%204950" target="_blank">1 250 544 4950

 

 



 

--

Dr K H Tang
Controller Area Network Solutions (M) Sdn Bhd
30, Jalan Puteri 5/12, Bandar Puteri, 47100 Puchong, Selangor, Malaysia.
http://www.cans.com.my
Mobile: +60 (0)12-306 2054
Tel: +60 (0)3-8061 6678 / 9678     Fax: +60 (0)3-8061 3789


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RE: J1939 turn signals

Bram Kerkhof
In reply to this post by John Dammeyer

Why not simply use a different SA for each lamp controller? Multiple nodes can send the same PGN without issue.

 

Bram

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of John Dammeyer
Sent: dinsdag 22 maart 2016 7:51
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [CANLIST] J1939 turn signals

 

Thank you.  The client uses that PGN  but not to the specification as listed in this file.

http://211.167.243.154:1012/file/gwbz/ISO%2011783-7-2002.PDF

 

But then this document is 2002 and for trailers so it may have been superseded and may not be relevant to the actual vehicle.  In either case that specification lists no less than 1 per second and no more than 10x per second which implies the master is responsible for the flashing.  Not the lamp. 

 

The lamp only turns on or off based on messages.

 

Of course this client also wanted all 4 lamps to report status information with the same ID.  Can you spell CAN message collision???

 

Sigh….  With the CAN bus in use now for more than 25 years one would think this wouldn’t happen anymore.

 

J1939 is such a mess…

 

John

 

 

 

From: [hidden email] [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Dr KH Tang
Sent: March-21-16 8:33 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [CANLIST] J1939 turn signals

 

Hello John, you may refer to PGN 65089.

 

On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 7:44 AM, John Dammeyer <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have a question about the operation of turn signals (and hazard) on a J1939 vehicle.   Is there a simple TURN SIGNAL ON message and then the lights take care of the flashing or does the central system issue LEFT SIDE TURN LIGHTS ON/OFF periodically in order to flash the lights?

 

Thanks

John Dammeyer

 

"ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"

Automation Artisans Inc.

http://www.autoartisans.com/ELS/

Ph. <a href="tel:1%20250%20544%204950" target="_blank">1 250 544 4950

 

 



 

--

Dr K H Tang
Controller Area Network Solutions (M) Sdn Bhd
30, Jalan Puteri 5/12, Bandar Puteri, 47100 Puchong, Selangor, Malaysia.
http://www.cans.com.my
Mobile: +60 (0)12-306 2054
Tel: +60 (0)3-8061 6678 / 9678     Fax: +60 (0)3-8061 3789

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RE: J1939 turn signals

John Dammeyer

I insisted on that.  Told them that there would be no warranty if they saw erratic operation with lamps not coming on or off when told since what they were asking for was an illegal CAN bus operation.

That fixed it.  Now I have 4 SA.  <GRIN>

John

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Bram Kerkhof
Sent: March-22-16 1:38 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [CANLIST] J1939 turn signals

 

Why not simply use a different SA for each lamp controller? Multiple nodes can send the same PGN without issue.

 

Bram